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I agree with Flying Squirrels, but I think he's mostly getting at your second point, and I think we all agree such trades are extremely rare.
Exeter Velos on
August 31, 2020 2:03 PM
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Veto should only happen if:
1) collusion
2) the trade is so so so bad, like objectively league altering bad that it warrants a veto.
That second one I've seen once and I've never observed a league with collusion yet.
If an owner "takes advantage" of a new to league or new to Ottoneu owner then that's a moment to call out but not veto. That owner may burn bridges for further deals with the newer owner or with other league members.
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Ok, so here's the problem with veto and why I completely stay away from it.
Fairness is completely biased and dependent on your own judgement. I will continually vilify veto since it should it's usually brandied about only by people who perceive a trade to be unfair because either they didn't make it or it betters someone they are competing against.
Not to say the situation doesn't exist for veto but I've seen it needed once ever.
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Yeah that is a fair point. I have always seen it as a stopping collusion, but I guess it is reasonable that if a trade is just ridiculously lopsided that you have rights to veto. I think there is just the fine line of vetoing because it is actually an unfair trade, or vetoing just because you think it gives an opponent an edge.
PickOff Picks on
August 31, 2020 1:46 PM
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Unrelated to any prior trade - just a question: Is there a point at which the inherent lopsidedness of a trade is its own “evidence of collusion”? To me, if a trade is just awful, we should be free to veto it. It takes 6 (7?) vetoes, so it is unlikely a trade will get cancelled unless it is really awful. No hurt feelings - just a vote on whether a trade is unfair. Let’s not vilify the veto. It is there for a reason.
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Carrasco and Nola are available before tomorrow
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I'm late to the party here but imo no trade should be vetoed unless there is evidence of collusion. That said, it's robbery and people are obviously going to be upset about it
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Haha, just read your trade block Synder!
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I echo the welcome and this is my first year in this league too and my first in season trade I've made. I can't speak to the norm given my newness but I sure hope this isn't the norm lol
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Nine Misfortunes, we don't normally argue like this. This is the most message board activity in like a year and a half. So welcome! Lol
Exeter Velos on
August 28, 2020 2:02 PM
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I didn't realize "it is known" about Luciano, and I'm a little more skeptical about Lopez, but that's why we have our own teams lol. I approved. Good luck to both.
Exeter Velos on
August 28, 2020 2:02 PM
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Winnetka, I don't believe in vetoes unless you can prove without the shadow of a doubt collusion and I've never witnessed that.
I for one won't veto (I already approved both) nor will I try to get the league to veto any trade just because I don't like it or because I don't like that it made a close competitor better. If two teams discussed a trade and were happy to accept then I approve. I'd appreciate it if you did the same.
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Turner and Bogaerts here!
Wreckers on
August 28, 2020 10:38 AM
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I still have Blackmon available for a contender before we hit the deadline!
PickOff Picks on
August 28, 2020 10:34 AM
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Veto the trades if you think they were not made in good faith, I have no problems with that.
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Or are these kinds of accusations only leveled against non-commish folks in this league?
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Not a good start for our new owner. Please discuss the merits of whether an owner should Approve/Veto these trades. This appears to me extremely fishy, and to have two trades with the commish agreed upon within 1 day of joining the league right after updating his/her trade block.
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luciano or juilo rod are next consensus #1 talents once Wander makes the mlb. it is known
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these are my scouting opinions not others, and you will surely remember pablo and marlins missed several games, so he is a couple GS behind. if you look at his FIP SIERA KBB% he is posting elite rates and is 24 years old. use fangraphs guys cmon
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Bell has not hit in over a year. I’m not sure he is a keeper. I would not keep Paxton.
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Pablo is 34th in points using a very small sample size. Pretty sure not in the top 100 last year.
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Luciano is only top 10 on a list of Giants prospects, but maybe you're right about Lopez.
Exeter Velos on
August 28, 2020 12:17 AM
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I'm not sure I would call Marco a top 10 when he is still a good 3 years away from being in the Majors. Pablo has maybe been a top 30 starter this year, 15 I think is a stretch. That being said, I still don't have a problem with the trade.
PickOff Picks on
August 27, 2020 11:45 PM
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marco is a top 10 prospect, pablo has been a top 15 sp, other 2 have veteran upside and all are cheap
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i traded 1 keeper for 4 whats the problem
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Coming from a Gerritt Cole owner, bounce back season still includes a bunch of home runs given up in that band box.
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I could see a veto for non-collusion if the trade was so far out of line with reality that it would ruin enjoyment of the game. I think the trade in question is a bad deal, but it does not reach my veto threshold. Still, I think normally you will get more trading star players separately, and by marketing them more widely. But who knows? Maybe Bell and Paxton have surprising bounce back seasons next year. Stranger things have happened.
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I believe the only reason for vetoing a trade is if there is collusion suspected, and I definitely don't believe that is happening so I don't have a problem with the trade.
PickOff Picks on
August 27, 2020 2:23 PM
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Thanks for the clarification, being new to the league this year I just wanted to make sure :).
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"Slander" was a joke, but I hear you. Does seem lopsided imo, but the players given up by Rake are on the expensive end, and I think it's fair to be high on Paxton, Luciano, etc.
Exeter Velos on
August 27, 2020 10:18 AM
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I'd like to add there shouldn't be any slander at all to either of us in that deal. We both discussed making a move back a forth over a couple of days and both arrived to an agreement that we both improved our own teams.
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Sorry for the confusion, but nonetheless, the trade should be looked at carefully.
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Correction: Rake Cronengirth is formerly Da Price is Wrong. Sorry for the slander, Vin lol. And either way, welcome to Nine Separate Misfortunes.
Exeter Velos on
August 27, 2020 9:20 AM
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Wait, sorry I'm wrong. I'm confused...
Exeter Velos on
August 27, 2020 9:12 AM
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That trade isn't from our new owner. Rake Cronengirth is formerly Vins Dulcet Tones. Our new owner is managing Nine Separate Misfortunes, formerly Frye's Fries.
Exeter Velos on
August 27, 2020 9:11 AM
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Not a good start for our new owner. Please discuss the merits of whether an owner should Approve/Veto this trade. This appears to me extremely unbalanced, and to be agreed upon within hours of joining the league without updating his/her trade block.
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Everyone welcome our new owner of Frye's Fries! We have a full league again!
PickOff Picks on
August 26, 2020 8:24 PM
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Our league now has the most expensive Cronenworth is the Ottoneu Universe. Close to what the Padres are paying him.
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outbid 😎😎😎😎
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If any contenders are interested in adding an edge for the stretch run, please check my trade block and let me know if you have any interest.
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I have abandoned and also posted it in the owners wanted forum. Hopefully we will have a new owner soon!
PickOff Picks on
August 24, 2020 1:04 PM
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Let’s get the team posted as abandoned. No currently available abandoned teams, so it will probably get claimed quickly.
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Looks like we lost Frye's Fries. Should we look for another manager?
Exeter Velos on
August 23, 2020 3:20 PM
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i spent like $95 on SP at the draft, they have given me net negative points and all been cut from my roster
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Paddack + Desclafani = minus 84 pitching. Also UGH.
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Ugh...what's keeping me in 4th/5th is that every 5 points I get in my batting lineup, I get 6 points from my bench (nearly 5 P/G!) Arrrrrgh
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Moose Wrastlers are ready to play ball!
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Is anybody interested in trading for 2020 value? I am open to ideas for anybody on my trade block.
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Where did you hear this?
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Apparently fans will be banned from live sports in 2021 also... Does anybody else share my fear live, professional baseball is not returning until 2022?
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