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Hi guys, I dropped a lot of teams (10 or 12 lately), but when I saw my old team in the CLAIM A TEAM and looked it over, I sais to myself you're crazy man, you loved that roster. So I claimed it, I'm not that kind of a guy to drop and claim and drop, firat time I do that since I'm with Ottoneu, so thanks for understanding, glad to be back
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Oh my did you just put Profar comp on Witt?
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I think Witt was the center of discussion because he's such a clear-cut Alpha Dog among prospects so he's an easy target. Of course, 10 years ago "Witt" would have = "Profar", so.....
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@Penhook, there was not a clear consensus on a league vote therefor we decided to go with standard league settings and allow MiLB arb.
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Welcome Soylent. Please renew your team prior to making any additional roster transactions.
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Did we ever decide on arbing prospects? Because my best value piece went up 250% all before making an MLB debut and being the main piece of discussion of who to arb….?
Penhook Heroes on
November 17, 2021 11:26 PM
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Welcome!
Penhook Heroes on
November 17, 2021 11:20 PM
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Yo! Looking forward to playing in this league guys. First time with Sabr Points but I've played other points leagues, so I'll figure it out in no time. Look forward to a busy off-season and a great season ahead.
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So as a competitive play, I think it's great to put money on prospects that I know will not force a cut, but as mentioned below by Chief it's only smart to put that money on the top of the top. There's maybe 4 MiLB players worth arb-ing this year.
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I think there's an inflection point and it's age based for me. So if it's "Do I put $2 on a 29 year old with young man skills, or the top prospect who's a slam dunk to be an All-Star" I'll put it on the kid. If it's the same but the 29 year old is 23 year old Juan Soto, I'll put it on Soto. I want my arb money allocated in Year 1 to hopefully still be on the payroll in Year 5 so that the owner is keeping the player but also forced to make other decisions around that keeper.
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Re arb-ing prospects: the arb money on a sure thing is going to stick longer and be a better competitive play. ie if every owner puts $1 on Witt today, and Witt goes from $6 to $17, he will debut far closer to his market value. If he's a stud then in year two he might be $30-35. Whereas if no one arbs Witt now, and we put our money on Trea Turner and Turner's speed deteriorates and Turner is a drop in 2 more years, then arb money allocated in Year 1 is gone in Year 3.
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I believe we are 10+ days past the World Series. Renewals are due. Thanks.
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Dammit, didn't get my arb done in time. Sorry folks, been a bit tied up and had that on my list to complete.
🍁Votto's RCMP on
November 15, 2021 9:08 AM
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Safe to say we didn’t reach a consensus so we’ll move forward with the default settings including MiLB arb. Don’t forget arbitration deadline is tomorrow.
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IMO Witt is gonna be a stud. Watching him play here in AAA he looks to be the real deal. Why wouldn't I put my arb money towards him? It is my money not? Ohh you have him on your team and you don't want your budget to get blown up? If you don't want to pay that money then trade/drop him. Pay up or let some else have him. Makes this more competitive. Also, I think Arb money is gonna go towards the top 10 or 15 prospects.
Only using Witt as an example. Not bashing him or his owner.
Pirate Fan on
November 12, 2021 8:10 AM
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i'm having a really hard time finding a reason to really care/vote one way or the other; whatever is decided is fine by me. i agree with Chief that there's seemingly no reason to arb a prospect unless the entire team is prospects; i'm also free market, so people should be free to allocate however they wish. so I guess, on balance, if forced to cast a firm vote...i would go with YES, allow MLB arb. (but really...there are better strategies than arbing prospects!)
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I would say that rostering Bobby Witt for a year or two should be rewarded as you're essentially punting a potential roster spot for that time. Once he hits MLB and if he deserves large arb, then so be it. But any team that hoards prospects isn't likely to be competitive in the first place. I think it allows for a likelihood of rebuilding if we eliminate arbitration allocations from non MLB service time players.
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But I fear that making it seem as though rostering the next wave of draft picks/J2 is more appealing bc their salaries won’t increase will lead to longer tanking cycles and a less competitive league. I guess my question is what’s the goal here, being a prospect hipster or being competitive?
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I’m pretty ambivalent about it. Part of me says there shouldn’t be any restrictions, arb who you want. Another part says arbing prospects is on average wasteful so restricting the ability to do it may be a boon to league health (e.g. I’d arb Witt, but pratto and Miranda? Prove it in the bigs and arb them heavily in ‘22 if they’re stars).
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I agree it would be best to have Chief Benders, Thunderducks, and Circus Monkeys weigh in. I'll try to message them and see if we can get them to weigh in. Getting down to crunch time here.
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I think it would be great to get to 7 or 8 or some higher level of agreement, but I'm not sure I would want to defer to abandoned teams and other teams without strong opinions or not voting. Any chance we can get any of the non-voting teams to weigh in?
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I don’t think we can enact a rule change on 60% of active owners saying yes. Thoughts?
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Current MiLB players with arbitration $ allocated are as follows:
Bobby Witt Jr
Nick Pratto
Jose Miranda
Should the majority agree to adopt no MiLB arbitration you'll need to reallocate those dollars or else they will be wasted as those player's salaries will be re-set.
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Looking back at the message board it appears CTI is against and sunny meadows if for it. That leaves us missing: Chief Benders, Thunderducks, and Circus Monkeys. k/9 & big papi are abandoned. Current vote appears to be:
6 against
2 for
2 no votes
I believe that makes a majority assuming that CTI and/or Sunny Meadows does not want to change their vote.
I'll leave this open to discuss until Wednesday at noon EST.
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5 against
1 for
2 teams are already abandoned so we'll need the remaining 4 members to vote. 1 more nay vote would be a majority of the remaining owners.
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no MILB arb
Penhook Heroes on
November 8, 2021 11:34 AM
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Chicken: no MILB arb
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3 against
1 for
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Yes is my vote
Pirate Fan on
November 8, 2021 7:19 AM
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Three votes for no MiLB arb. I’d like to have a resolution by 11/10 so people have four days to complete arbitration allocations. Need a majority one way or the other.
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CTI: No MiLB arb.
🍁Votto's RCMP on
November 7, 2021 12:10 PM
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This is the 2nd year we've discussed it. I'm for not allowing MILB arbitration because I like the idea that you can add a minor leaguer for $1, they get a $1 raise and then you go into the next season with a chance to let that player develop or maybe get to the majors. If the top prospects all cost $5-$10 by the time they make their first appearance in the majors I think it works against rebuilding or even finding some upside.
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We’ve never stipulated arbitration rules. We’ve had discussion surrounding not allocating arb to anyone without MLB experience but have only seen arb start going toward those players in the past couple of seasons.
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What was allowed in the past years?
Pirate Fan on
November 6, 2021 10:33 AM
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Nuke's: No MILB arbitration.
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CBA - no MILB arbitration
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Let's clear up where we all stand on arb to players with no MLB experience. I see quite a bit of arb attributed to players with that classification. Everyone please weight in with a vote.
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Reminder - renewal is due 1 week following the completion of the World Series. Go Braves!
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Correct, minor leaguers would get the regular year-to-year raises, but no additional arb $ from other owners. I'd vote that teams cannot add arb $'s to minor league players they didn't bid up in the auction process. Let them get to the majors and then use arb $'s.
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If you are new to this league and have claimed an abandoned team: welcome! Please know our league has a unique rule: new owners must immediately renew for next season. Please do so within 24 hrs of claiming the team and make no transactions, arbitration or other, until renewing. All owners in all seasons must pay for the next season within 10 days of the end of the World Series, that is our universal renewal date for this league annually.
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For the two departing teams, please allocate arb now (only to MLB and not MiLB if you would not mind, while we sort this out) and we will then remove you as owner. Thanks for playing, be well!
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Or my vote is yes? I want to be able to add to minor leaguers.
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My vote is no. I would prefer to maintain the choice to allocate to whoever I think deserves the increase on a team.
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Just want to clarify that we're talking about additional arbitration on top of the year over year automatic arb.... correct?
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Same AC!
🍁Votto's RCMP on
October 15, 2021 12:38 AM
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Let’s vote on it! I vote for no arb for MILB.
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We definitely discussed no arb for milb but I don’t recall if we had an agreement. I would definitely saving this.
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Did we all agree to not allocate arbitration $'s to minor league players who have never appeared in the majors? I'd like to have that an informal rule in this league if possible and I know we have discussed on this message board in the past. Just want to be clear about it before arbitration starts.
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Appears fixed. Per Niv don't make any cuts until after arb or they will experience a cap penalty. I don't remember this being the case in the past.
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If your team is in an illegal state there seems to be a glitch right now. I was over cap and cut to get below but was charged a cap penalty, which should not happen in the off-season. I'm sure Niv will fix this in the coming days.
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