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I obviously own neither player so it's not like I have a horse in this race. Just not seeing any rate stats suggesting that these guys are equivalent ottoneu players.
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 13, 2013 11:27 AM
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Espinosa just played a 160-game season and finished outside the top 12 2B. Walker is trending upward if you look at his numbers month by month. Espinosa is what he is at this point, his contact skills are not improving.
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 13, 2013 11:24 AM
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He played in 129 games last season, or 29 games more than Utley has averaged over the past three years. I expect about 730 points from Walker in about 155 games. But like I said, it doesn't matter where he ranks. What matters is that he's available
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in his 3 years he's played 110/159/129. So he's a lock for 160?
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He only played in 129 games
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He was 18th last year, so he is no doubt "easily top 12" this year. This message board always contains some baffling statements to me
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This trade is basically TdA + Putz for Skaggs + X, with X being what I eventually get for Walker, which is more than I would have gotten for Putz
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I'd expect Walker to settle in at about 730 points this season, maybe more. Where he ranks him according to 2B matters very little. What matters is that he's easily top 12 and someone, at some point, will need a 2B, & I'll have one of the few to offer
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How is Neil Walker's floor higher than any number of points he's scored in any season in his career?
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I love this league.
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all of the numbers you claim are 'on your side' up to this point support my argument.
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 10:42 AM
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That's awesome War Horse, good for you. Yes, Walker's numbers are better,that's not the argument - the argument is by how much, and so far the answer is 'not by much.' You think that'll change, I disagree.
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 10:42 AM
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Don't get me wrong Branham did well in getting the elite hitting prospect with clear path to major leagues. But walker isn't just throwaway depth, he could easily be a top 10 2B.
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 13, 2013 10:29 AM
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I'm home sick today...maybe I'll have time to work on Power Rankings, which I haven't done yet. Branham has a good, well rounded team. TdA should help him as soon as he's up, and Putz makes up for some early RP injury issues.
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We can disagree but I'm pretty sure I have things like RC and wOBA on my side...
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 13, 2013 10:26 AM
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I have no problem agreeing that it is probably better for Branham now because he didn't need Walker and TdA is likely better than Skaggs. However, as my team takes shape for 2014 this deal makes sense for what I needed to do. Walker will be a trade chip.
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By what statistical measure is Walker not clearly superior than Espinosa? Fielding WAR maybe. Trying to understand why he's a valuable dynasty piece, just not seeing it.
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 13, 2013 10:25 AM
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We'll just have to agree to disagree on the value difference between Espinosa and Walker. I really like this deal for Syndicate.
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 10:23 AM
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Almost always prefer the bat to the arm, but in this case I needed the arm and am very comfortable with Montero as my only C. It's not like TdA hasn't had his injury concerns, either. C is just so grueling that they usually take a long time to produce.
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Not saying that either team got hosed here, but walker is clearly the best 2013 player in the trade. Putz only has value because he happens to be a closer at this particular moment. He's injury prone and hernandez is 10x better.
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 13, 2013 10:18 AM
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Espinosa wasn't available; he wasn't going to trade him (neither would I). Deal made good sense for Branham b/c Walker was an extra piece. I think he has more to me value than Putz. Losing TdA hurt, but I wanted an arm like Skaggs. Better fit for my team.
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Espinosas floor is 300 points and then bumped by Rendon. Walkers floor is 750 and his ceiling is 900 ?.
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 13, 2013 10:13 AM
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Couldn't disagree more. Espinosa is a blah player who has clearly plateaued. Walker was just hitting another gear when his back issues began.
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 13, 2013 10:11 AM
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I'm just saying after looking closely, Syndicate probably improved this season and definitely improved long term.
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 10:06 AM
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I'm not saying you should've taken Espinosa instead Strikes, I'm saying Syndicate took almost no hit at MI to his lineup with this deal.
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 10:05 AM
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So basically, Syndicate gave up 70 pts at MI (at most). If Putz is 70 pts better than other RP options syndicate could've used, TdA production this year is just a bonus (and Syndicate until this deal rostered just 1 C).
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 10:05 AM
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Walker doesn't have demolish Espinosa to have significant value. The difference is that Walker is a) above average and b) available, unlike Espinosa. 2B is so thin I'd feel comfortable keeping him or trading him this season for another solid piece.
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Espinosa also has SS eligibility - if I could deal for either at same price it'd be him.
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 9:59 AM
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Even if he kept that 4.8 pt/game pace up, Espinosa was 4.4 last year (and more the year before). That .417 point difference over 162 games is just 67 points - real big demolition. I also think Espinosa is better than he scored last year.
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 9:58 AM
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If Neil Walker hits like he hit before his injury then he will demolish Simmons and Espinosa.
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 13, 2013 9:37 AM
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http://www.minorleagueball.com/2013/3/13/4095252/minor-league-ball-top-150-prospects-for-2013-john-sickels
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Admittedly, I'm not completely sold on Skaggs yet but should find out soon. I think you can get by having one stud C in this league (Wieters, Santana, Mauer, etc) and I'm hoping Montero can become that this season. We'll see...
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Pretty confident I can move Walker late in the season easier than Putz. 2B is just so weak, somebody will go down and will need a replacement. Branham probably gets the best player in the deal in TdA, but I really wanted another arm to build around.
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If I knew TdA was about to be moved I would've tried harder to make an offer, huge fan.
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 8:02 AM
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If I knew TdA was about to be moved I would've tried harder to make an offer, huge fan.
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 8:02 AM
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The drop from Neil Walker to Espinosa or Simmons isn't huge, so I can see why Syndicate did it though.
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 8:01 AM
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I agree... not sure it makes sense from either team's perspective, unless TdA arrives in a major way this season. Either way I like this better for Syndicate, but that may just be how much I like TdA
Caimans 🐊 on
March 13, 2013 8:00 AM
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I guess I just feel like Putz-quality RP will emerge on the waiver wire in April and May for way less than $9. TdA is obviously a stud but so is Skaggs. Seems like it hurts the contending team's 2013 chances and the rebuilding team's prospect hoard.
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 13, 2013 7:48 AM
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+1....with two banged up RP getting a top closer was huge for me, I LOVE D'arnoud as my catcher of the future, and Dahl is a stud prospect. Trade fit both of us...
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Branham really needed another catcher too. I'm good to roll with Montero for now
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While I like TdA better than Skaggs, it's close, and I was looking for one more future arm. Getting Walker for Putz gives me a more tradeable asset, and Branham strengthens an already great bullpen. Choice gives me an ETA closer to my window to compete
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Not sure that I understand that deal from either team's perspective...
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 12, 2013 10:51 PM
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Greinke and Halladay now gimping up... Not good.
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 12, 2013 8:01 PM
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I became disinterested in Facebook when my Mother figured out how to use it.
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The Syndicate's trading block has been updated!
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How many more days of this spring training bs?
Eckfords ⚾ on
March 12, 2013 4:42 PM
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Great start from Teheran today. If he's turned a corner could be a nice bargain for Durham
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I like Fried; didn't think I'd get Smoak. Tough decision, but came down to Fried's long ETA. I can always pick him up later. Surprised no one bid on Smoak. Seems easy gamble for $1
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Aw, now I feel left out.
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I love that Trey gives advance notice of cuts with a flurry of trade offers involving the soon to be released player...
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